FT : Brexit knocks French wine exports to UK

Brexit knocks French wine exports to UK
The weak pound may force British wine merchants out of business

The fall in the pound following the UK’s vote for Brexit will be, wine commentators have tended to agree, good for the English wine industry — a cheaper pound means more exports.

There has been less attention paid to what weaker sterling means for French producers, whose second-biggest export market has become that much more expensive to sell into.

Figures from 2016 give some weight to this fear that French exports will fall. The French wine industry’s FEVS export federation said exports fell 0.8 per cent to €7.9bn, “mainly due to the impact of the pound sterling [fall] on champagne sales in the United Kingdom”. The pound has lost 14 per cent against the euro since before the June 2016 referendum.

“The French are being remarkably complacent about the situation,” says Jason Yapp, managing director of independent wine merchants Yapp Bros, which deals particularly with producers in the Rhône, the Loire and the Languedoc. “I think it’s a disaster. Only two producers we deal with have made concessions on price as a result of the currency devaluation.”

Mr Yapp believes that French wine is going to become up to 25 per cent more expensive in the next 12-18 months. “Some British merchants are going to go to the wall as French producers look for other export markets” that can afford their prices, he says. “We at Yapps are digging in for a long siege.”

Christian Seely, managing director of AXA Millésimes, which owns eminent Bordeaux estates including Château Pichon-Baron, is more phlegmatic.

“Generally I just think it needs to be considered in the context of the very long trading history of wine between Bordeaux and London,” he says. “This existed for centuries before the European Union was ever thought of.”

While he concedes that the fall in the value of sterling since Brexit means that wines from Bordeaux are at the moment more expensive to British wine drinkers than before, Mr Seely points out that “sterling has fluctuated up and down against the French currency many times in the past and it has not stopped the British drinking the wines of Bordeaux, nor will it now.”

At the more expensive end of the market, with the wines that collectors “must have”, there is likely to be the least change: producers will not budge on price and consumers can afford them. Wine brokers and top-end restaurants in the UK report healthy sales to Asian and Russian consumers taking advantage of sterling’s fall.

In the mid-market, merchants have been trading on stocks that were bought some time ago at keen prices, but these will soon be exhausted. When it comes to repurchasing, they will find that producers have not dropped their prices, even though sterling has fallen. If the French do not lower prices, British merchants may look elsewhere, the merchants say.

If British consumers start to trade down from Bordeaux, Burgundy and champagne, producers in the Rhône and the Languedoc may see the benefit. Mr Yapp says that this is already happening. They may also look even further afield to Australia.

Will Hargrove, head of fine wine at merchants Corney & Barrow, is not convinced the French are too troubled.

“It might be harder to hit certain price points in the everyday bracket, and that will mean more competition from outside France and even Europe, but on the flip side the exchange hasn’t been great for some time and the competition has been there for a while now. I believe French producers will take the view that the UK remains a key market and that, as long as quality remains high, there will be demand.”

WSJ : HNA Obscured Ownership Stakes in Gategroup Deal, Swiss Regulator Says

HNA Obscured Ownership Stakes in Gategroup Deal, Swiss Regulator Says
Chinese firm didn’t disclose the extent of co-founders’ holdings, Swiss Takeover Board says

Chinese conglomerate HNA Group Co. supplied false information and failed to disclose key ownership stakes of some of its executives while acquiring a company last year, a Swiss regulator found.

The regulator, the Swiss Takeover Board, said Friday that HNA, which has been facing increasing scrutiny from regulators in the U.S. and China, last year gave incorrect information about two of its own stakeholders in its offer prospectus for its $1.5 billion deal to acquire Swiss air-travel logistics company Gategroup Holding AG.

The board said HNA inaccurately represented the ownership stake held by Beijing resident Guan Jun, as well as that of Bharat Bhise, chief executive of Hong Kong-based private-equity and investment advisory firm Bravia Capital.

The regulator said their share holdings were actually 12.01% and 17.15%, respectively, not 12.35% and 17.4%, as HNA had claimed in the offer prospectus.

HNA also failed to disclose that the two were holding stakes on behalf of the company’s co-founders, including Chen Feng, Wang Jian and Adam Tan, who should have been listed as the beneficial owners of the shares, the regulator said.

The Swiss regulator earlier this year had asked HNA to provide more information about its ownership and shifting of stakes during the acquisition process.

The company, which announced more than $40 billion worth of deals between early 2015 and October, has been scrambling to explain its ownership and corporate structure to the lenders and banks that advise it. One of its deals is currently being held up by U.S. regulators.

The Swiss regulator said Ernst & Young LLP will examine whether HNA’s top executives followed the country’s minimum-price regulations and best-price rules during the acquisition. HNA will pay operating costs of 50,000 Swiss francs ($51,000) and could face monetary penalties for failing to provide complete information during the takeover. The size of such a potential penalty, if one is imposed, hasn’t been made clear.

“We cooperated fully with the Swiss Takeover Board’s inquiry, and we respect its authority in this matter,” a spokesman for HNA said.

Barron's : Hapag-Lloyd Shares Set to Steam North

Hapag-Lloyd Shares Set to Steam North

The container shipping industry, often dubbed the lifeblood of our planet’s economy, just might be enjoying its best conditions in nearly a decade, and Germany’s Hapag-Lloyd looks like a promising way to play the revival.

Germany faces political uncertainty after talks to form a coalition government flopped this month, but Chancellor Angela Merkel’s latest headache is “not a factor for them at all, given the global nature of the business,” Joel Spungin, Berenberg Bank’s London-based head of transport and logistics research, tells Barron’s.

The No. 1 driver for logistics-related enterprises is global trade volume, which is up about 4.3% this year, even as protectionism re-emerges as a threat, according to Spungin and his colleagues.

Another big reason why the backdrop has improved for Hapag-Lloyd (ticker: HLAG.Germany) and its rivals: the 2016 bankruptcy filing of Korean peer Hanjin Shipping, which took vessels off the market and helped spark more consolidation and alliances. The industry’s survivors are also showing some restraint in ordering vessels, after new ships that hit the water about 10 years ago helped turn a prior boom into a downturn. As the analysts led by Spungin recently wrote: “The stars have not been this aligned for the industry for many years.”

HAPAG-LLOYD IS THE BERENBERG TEAM’S PREFERRED BET on container shipping, in part because of its valuation. Its price-to-book-value ratio is around 0.9, versus the peer group average of 1.1, even though the stock has advanced about 50% this year.

Other positives include the company’s fleet, which is, on average, younger, bigger, and more efficient than rivals’, plus its diversified base of customers. The Berenberg analysts, whose bank holds Hapag shares and has done business with the company in the past 12 months, also see potential for additional benefits from a merger with United Arab Shipping, or UASC. Completed in May, the deal was valued at $7.8 billion to $9 billion.

Berenberg has a Buy rating on Hapag-Lloyd, the world’s fifth-biggest container shipping company, and a price target of 40 euros ($47). That roughly matches the average target among all analysts covering Hapag, according to FactSet, and it implies a rally of about 20%.

The shares have pulled back more than 10% this month, with Spungin blaming the selloff, in part, on worries that the company might downgrade its freight-rate guidance after a downbeat quarterly report on Nov. 7 from the No. 1 shipper, A.P. Moeller-Maersk (MAERSKB.Denmark).

However, Hapag’s encouraging third-quarter results, announced on Nov. 15, helped the stock. “Key things were the reiteration of guidance for the full year on expected freight rates and the confirmation that the process of integrating the UASC acquisition is on track,” says Spungin.

IN EUROPE LAST WEEK, the major equity benchmarks mostly advanced, though Germany’s DAX lagged, as investors assessed the Nov. 19 breakdown in negotiations to establish a coalition government. The short-term impact on the German economy should be close to zero, but the country’s political parties “should not waste too much time if they don’t want to put the economy’s future at risk,” writes Carsten Brzeski, an ING economist, in a note.

Barron's : Hapag-Lloyd Shares Set to Steam North

Hapag-Lloyd Shares Set to Steam North

The container shipping industry, often dubbed the lifeblood of our planet’s economy, just might be enjoying its best conditions in nearly a decade, and Germany’s Hapag-Lloyd looks like a promising way to play the revival.

Germany faces political uncertainty after talks to form a coalition government flopped this month, but Chancellor Angela Merkel’s latest headache is “not a factor for them at all, given the global nature of the business,” Joel Spungin, Berenberg Bank’s London-based head of transport and logistics research, tells Barron’s.

The No. 1 driver for logistics-related enterprises is global trade volume, which is up about 4.3% this year, even as protectionism re-emerges as a threat, according to Spungin and his colleagues.

Another big reason why the backdrop has improved for Hapag-Lloyd (ticker: HLAG.Germany) and its rivals: the 2016 bankruptcy filing of Korean peer Hanjin Shipping, which took vessels off the market and helped spark more consolidation and alliances. The industry’s survivors are also showing some restraint in ordering vessels, after new ships that hit the water about 10 years ago helped turn a prior boom into a downturn. As the analysts led by Spungin recently wrote: “The stars have not been this aligned for the industry for many years.”

HAPAG-LLOYD IS THE BERENBERG TEAM’S PREFERRED BET on container shipping, in part because of its valuation. Its price-to-book-value ratio is around 0.9, versus the peer group average of 1.1, even though the stock has advanced about 50% this year.

Other positives include the company’s fleet, which is, on average, younger, bigger, and more efficient than rivals’, plus its diversified base of customers. The Berenberg analysts, whose bank holds Hapag shares and has done business with the company in the past 12 months, also see potential for additional benefits from a merger with United Arab Shipping, or UASC. Completed in May, the deal was valued at $7.8 billion to $9 billion.

Berenberg has a Buy rating on Hapag-Lloyd, the world’s fifth-biggest container shipping company, and a price target of 40 euros ($47). That roughly matches the average target among all analysts covering Hapag, according to FactSet, and it implies a rally of about 20%.

The shares have pulled back more than 10% this month, with Spungin blaming the selloff, in part, on worries that the company might downgrade its freight-rate guidance after a downbeat quarterly report on Nov. 7 from the No. 1 shipper, A.P. Moeller-Maersk (MAERSKB.Denmark).

However, Hapag’s encouraging third-quarter results, announced on Nov. 15, helped the stock. “Key things were the reiteration of guidance for the full year on expected freight rates and the confirmation that the process of integrating the UASC acquisition is on track,” says Spungin.

IN EUROPE LAST WEEK, the major equity benchmarks mostly advanced, though Germany’s DAX lagged, as investors assessed the Nov. 19 breakdown in negotiations to establish a coalition government. The short-term impact on the German economy should be close to zero, but the country’s political parties “should not waste too much time if they don’t want to put the economy’s future at risk,” writes Carsten Brzeski, an ING economist, in a note.

Barron's : Tencent Stock Still Has Lots of Upside

Tencent Stock Still Has Lots of Upside

The world’s best-performing large-cap stock this year?

It’s not a FANG name, but rather Shenzhen-based Tencent Holdings (ticker: 0700.Hong Kong), which trades on the pink sheets in the U.S. ( TCEHY). With a market capitalization exceeding $529 billion, Tencent is now the globe’s fifth-largest listed company, bigger than Facebook (FB), and closing in on No. 4 Amazon.com (AMZN). And its stock still looks good.

Tencent is up 125% this year, 732% over the past five years, 4,323% over 10 years, and a split-adjusted 570-fold since its initial public offering in June 2004. A mere $1,764 investment on the day of its IPO would be worth $1 million today.

“It is a stock that everybody loves,” says Chelsey Tam, an Internet analyst for Morningstar in Hong Kong. And a gift that keeps on giving. For the past two years, analysts have kept raising their price target, yet no sooner do they hike it, than investors chase it to well above their most optimistic targets. Tam’s current target is 492 Hong Kong dollars (US$62.99), or 18% upside after Friday’s comeback by the Chinese markets, which had swooned by 3% on Thursday.

How long can the world’s most loved stock of the past decade keep surging? “As long as it can continue to deliver on earnings and widen its moat,” Tam tells Barron’s. She expects Tencent’s revenue to grow 60% this year and 53% next year, up from 47% last year. And she sees earnings rising more than 50.4% this year and nearly 40% in 2018. And, unlike Chinese counterparts Alibaba (BABA) and Baidu (BIDU) or global peers Alphabet (GOOGL), Facebook, and Amazon, Tencent pays a small dividend.

Think of Tencent as a sprawling tech conglomerate in the mold of Berkshire Hathaway (BRK.A), which is 15% smaller. Tencent is the world’s largest interactive gaming company, with titles like League of Legends. It operates China’s biggest social network. Tencent Music is China’s dominant music-streaming player. Tencent Video looks like YouTube and Netflix (NFLX) rolled into one. And WeChat messenger’s billion users make it a tad bigger than Facebook’s WhatsApp. Tencent is also boosting its advertising business, taking share from Baidu. Bhavtosh Vajpayee of Sanford C. Bernstein in Hong Kong estimates that Tencent, which had $1.1 billion in ad revenue last year, will have $7 billion by 2019.

The jewel in Tencent’s crown is its growing financial-technology business, which includes the WeChat Pay payment system, wealth management products, and insurance and small-business lending operations. And, oh, it has a 5% stake in Tesla (TSLA), owns more than 12% of Snap (SNAP), and reportedly has considered buying a small piece of Twitter (TWTR).

Tencent wants to use Snapchat’s platform to expand its gaming business in the developed world, says Morningstar’s Tam. It is also interested in teaming up with Tesla to help in its own driverless-car ambitions in China.

WeChat Pay recently got a license to operate a payment and fintech business in Malaysia and wants to do so across the region. The WeChat messaging service is being rolled out aggressively in the United Kingdom, a prequel to expanding the ecosystem to payments and other services there.

Global investors are way underexposed to Tencent, says Catherine Tan, a portfolio manager with Excel Funds in Toronto. Excel, which bought Tencent stock years ago and has had a great ride, isn’t about to sell. “Tencent has a solid competitive moat that is illustrative of the strong secular New China growth theme,” says Tan, adding that it still has plenty of room to grow.

Barron's : A Bullish Case for Oil Prices

A Bullish Case for Oil Prices

Writing about oil prices is always risky. In January 2015, I suggested that oil prices would not continue to fall, and even predicted that they would “finish the year higher than they were when it began.” I was wrong then, but I might not be wrong for much longer.

I recently spoke at the massive Abu Dhabi International Petroleum Exhibition & Conference, which is a kind of Davos for oil-market participants. While there, I caught the tail end of a discussion among senior oil executives who all agreed that at this time next year, crude oil will still be around $60 per barrel, as it is today.

I was about to be interviewed by CNBC reporter Steve Sedgwick, to whom I said, “That would be a first. Oil prices hardly moving in a year?” Needless to say, Sedgwick began the interview by telling the audience what I had said, and quizzed me on why I disagreed with the others.

Before I get to my explanation, let me state the usual caveats. Forecasting oil prices is inevitably a fraught endeavor; in fact, it makes forecasting currency markets look easy. When I completed a doctorate on oil markets in the late 1970s and early 1980s, I had already concluded that trying to guess oil prices is a waste of time and energy. Later, when I was at Goldman Sachs, I was often amused to see commodity analysts in my research group struggling to cope with the usual chaos of oil-price developments.

WHILE INTERVIEWING ME, Sedgwick raised an interesting point: Given that the volatility of many other asset prices has declined sharply in recent years, it might just be a matter of time before oil and other commodity prices do the same. To be sure, that could very well happen. In principle, he is right.

But I would argue that the decline in volatility in currency, bond, and equity markets largely reflects low inflation in many parts of the world, and the lack of significant monetary-policy adjustments by major central banks in recent years. I’m not sure that these factors apply to oil in the same way, especially at a time when energy markets are on the cusp of big changes in supply and demand.

On the demand side, market commentators are finally waking up to something that has been pretty clear for most of 2017: The world economy has gained momentum and is now probably growing at a rate of 4% or higher. With the exception of India and the United Kingdom, eight of the 10 largest economies are expanding at the same time. And even as many countries try to wean themselves off oil, that transition will not happen overnight. Accordingly, oil markets are adjusting to stronger demand.

On the supply side, the world’s most important marginal supplier of oil, Saudi Arabia, has suddenly drawn a lot of wary eyes. The Saudi government has been implementing radical changes, both domestically and in its foreign policy, and its reasons for doing so are not entirely clear. Not surprisingly, market participants suddenly want to add a premium to the price of oil.

IN MY TWO SPEECHES at the Abu Dhabi conference, I shared a slide with trendlines for the Brent crude-oil spot price and the five-year forward price. I have long defaulted to watching the five-year forward price for lack of a more fundamentals-based approach to thinking about the equilibrium price of oil. As I explained in January 2015, the Brent crude-oil spot price is less subject to speculative fluctuations, and is thus a purer approximation of underlying commercial supply and demand factors.

The chart that I prepared, which was made before the latest oil-price acceleration in early November, shows the five-year forward oil price picking up after a period of some stability. With the spot price having now moved above the five-year forward price, one could conclude that a trend change is under way. For my part, I’m unsure, but I wouldn’t be surprised if it happened.

Let us return to Sedgwick’s question. While oil prices could be about $60 per barrel in November 2018, my guess is that they will have risen to about $80 per barrel in the meantime.

Sedgwick also asked me how oil companies might be able to make their investment and operational decision-making less beholden to cyclical factors. Is it possible for oil companies to temper their excitement during periods of rising prices, and not to fall into a malaise when prices are low for lengthy periods?

It’s a tough question. My answer is that oil companies need to complete the commodity-analysis quest that I started but never finished. They must come up with a credible method for estimating the underlying equilibrium price of oil. Then, as soon as the oil price exceeds two standard deviations of that equilibrium, they should start to ignore the fashionable advice of colleagues, analysts, and industry insiders.

JIM O’NEILL, a former chairman of Goldman Sachs Asset Management and a former U.K. Treasury minister, is honorary professor of economics at the University of Manchester and former chairman of the British government’s Review on Antimicrobial Resistance.

BArron's Cover : How to Play Emerging Markets Now

How to Play Emerging Markets Now

America first? Not when it comes to world stocks.

In a year full of political and economic drama, emerging markets have outpaced an aging bull market in the U.S. over the last 12 months. Still, the prospect of Beijing wielding a heavier hand in Chinese companies and economic reforms in India potentially slowing near-term growth means that investors who take a closer look now will need to pick their spots carefully.

The MSCI Emerging Markets Index is up 34% so far this year, beating the 16% advance in the Standard & Poor’s 500 index and last year’s 9% gain, as emerging markets crawled out of a three-year slump on the hope of an economic and earnings recovery.

That recovery materialized this year as China, Russia, and India found firmer fiscal footing and weathered developments that would have derailed them before. President Michel Temer of Brazil narrowly dodged prosecution on corruption charges in the latest political scandal that

Hit about a year after his predecessor, Dilma Rousseff, was impeached. Russia pushed on despite another round of U.S. sanctions, and India made unprecedented reforms, like a demonetization that took 86% of the country’s cash out of circulation last fall and sent the cash-dependent economy into chaos—yet markets were resilient.

Barron's
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Barron's Cover

How to Play Emerging Markets Now
By
Reshma Kapadia
November 25, 2017

How to Play Emerging Markets Now
Photo: Pomme Chan

America first? Not when it comes to world stocks.

In a year full of political and economic drama, emerging markets have outpaced an aging bull market in the U.S. over the last 12 months. Still, the prospect of Beijing wielding a heavier hand in Chinese companies and economic reforms in India potentially slowing near-term growth means that investors who take a closer look now will need to pick their spots carefully.

The MSCI Emerging Markets Index is up 34% so far this year, beating the 16% advance in the Standard & Poor’s 500 index and last year’s 9% gain, as emerging markets crawled out of a three-year slump on the hope of an economic and earnings recovery.

That recovery materialized this year as China, Russia, and India found firmer fiscal footing and weathered developments that would have derailed them before. President Michel Temer of Brazil narrowly dodged prosecution on corruption charges in the latest political scandal that
Emerging Markets Rally Still Has Some Steam--In Some Markets
Rajiv Jain of the GQG Partners Emerging Markets Equity fund sees more gains ahead in some emerging markets. Plus, why he is more optimistic about Russia, is decreasing his positions in India and the risk he is monitoring in Chinese tech stocks.

Hit about a year after his predecessor, Dilma Rousseff, was impeached. Russia pushed on despite another round of U.S. sanctions, and India made unprecedented reforms, like a demonetization that took 86% of the country’s cash out of circulation last fall and sent the cash-dependent economy into chaos—yet markets were resilient.

Investors who haven’t paid much attention to emerging markets since they were last this hot in 2009 are taking notice. About $85 billion has poured into emerging market stock funds so far this year, the biggest net flows since 2010, according to EPFR Global. The draw is valuations: Even after the sharp gains, the MSCI Emerging Markets Index still trades at 12 times forward earnings, far cheaper than U.S. stocks’ 18 times, or Europe’s 14 times.

Investors may want to rethink their strategy. Betting on the consumer is still a good strategy, but not via old standbys like luxury-goods makers and companies selling beer or soap. India, a favored market in recent years, is now expensive and facing near-term challenges as it pushes through major economic reforms. And Chinese internet stocks—like Tencent Holdings (ticker: 700.Hong Kong), which recently surpassed Facebook (FB) in market value, and Alibaba Group Holding (BABA)—that have powered the market higher could face the risk of government intervention.

We gathered four emerging market stock fund managers in New York to discover the best spots to invest and identify which risks they are monitoring. Our experts are Taizo Ishida, co-manager of the $812 million Matthews Asia Growth (MPACX) and the $439 million Matthews Emerging Asia (MEASX) funds; Rajiv Jain, who earned a stellar record at Vontobel Asset Management and left last year to start his own firm, where he runs the $454 million GQG Partners Emerging Markets Equity fund (GQGPX); Howard Schwab, co-manager of the $1.8 billion Driehaus Emerging Markets Growth fund (DREGX); and Leon Eidelman, co-manager of the $4.8 billion JPMorgan Emerging Markets Equity (JFAMX).

Barron’s: What a year! What have been the most notable events?

Leon Eidelman: We had plenty of drama. South African President Jacob Zuma ousted the finance minister in a cabinet reshuffle that sent the currency tumbling; there was an attempted Turkish coup; and the political scandals in Brazil. But what matters most to markets is earnings. Last year, investors began to anticipate an earnings recovery as currencies and commodity prices recovered. Earnings growth had been absent for the past seven years, but now we are seeing it—and it is widespread. That is a positive signal for the next couple of years.

Rajiv Jain: Emerging markets are seeing synchronized pickup in economic growth across the board. That revival is the fruit of good policies born out of bad times. Brazil, India, Russia, and even China implemented reforms after their heavy borrowing during the good times caught up with their currencies. Now, current account deficits have narrowed sharply in many of these countries, budget deficits have fallen, and currencies are sensibly valued. That has led to better earnings growth.

What were some of those reforms, and do they make emerging markets more resilient as the Federal Reserve raises interest rates? In 2013, the hint of the Fed reducing its bond buying sent markets into a tailspin.

Howard Schwab: Emerging markets are less fragile than in 2013. Now, about two-thirds of the bonds of listed companies are denominated in local currencies, not dollars, making them less vulnerable to a U.S. rate hike. India implemented reforms to get its balance sheet back in order; Brazil has begun to privatize its electric utilities and overhaul labor rules; Russia’s central bank has been far more conservative in setting monetary policy. The Chinese government has been taking measures to stem speculative activity in some property markets, including banning resales within a specified period of time. That should help dampen risk.

Investors have been drawn to emerging markets because they’ve been cheaper than U.S. and European stocks. After a 34% run-up this year, they’re still cheaper, but how much further can they run?

Taizo Ishida: We’re in the fourth inning of this rally. We are not going to see the same massive return as last year, but earnings growth is strong against a favorable backdrop of low inflation and low commodity prices. Though the market looks expensive on a price/earnings basis, free cash flow is growing a lot. Two years ago, free-cash-flow yield was an amazingly high 10%; it is still a reasonable 7.5%. Alibaba and Tencent have more than doubled year-to-date, but P/E multiples have been relatively consistent over the past five years because of strong earnings growth. Valuations don’t signal a crisis, but things are not cheap anymore.

Jain: Some parts of the market are overvalued. A few years ago, investors were willing to pay up for companies with stable growth because earnings growth was so scarce. But now, as earnings growth recovers, that stability is overvalued, especially in consumer staples. Brazilian brewer Ambev’s [ABEV3.Brazil] margins are shrinking and there’s no volume growth, and Indian tobacco company ITC [ITC.India] is also struggling. Yet they trade at much higher multiples than just a few years ago. On the other hand, anything even a little cyclical—but high quality—is more attractive, like Bank Central Asia [BBCA.Indonesia], a classic consumer-oriented bank in Indonesia that is the lowest-cost deposit gatherer, has the strongest balance sheet, and is well positioned as Indonesia’s economy recovers.

Ishida: We picked up Indian skin- and hair-care company Emami [HMN.India] in late 2011 because it was a better value than Dabur India [DABUR.India], the go-to consumer staple at the time. We recently sold Emami because it became very expensive, trading at 60 times earnings. Indian consumer staples are so loved by global investors it is very difficult to find a replacement.

What, then, are you buying?

Schwab: Alibaba, Tencent, Samsung Electronics [005930.Korea], and Taiwan Semiconductor [TSM] have contributed about a third of the market’s gains this year. As many of the more popular stocks, like technology, have gotten more expensive and revenue growth has faded compared with 15 years ago, we are focusing more on companies that can expand multiples or improve margins or returns. Better governance helps, like at Samsung Electronics, which split the CEO and chairman roles and committed to returning cash to shareholders.

Ishida: There are more reasonably priced options in mid- and small-cap stocks. Baozun [BZUN], a $1.6 billion Chinese online retailer, is a cheaper alternative to big e-commerce stocks. Global brands like Nike [NKE] have had a hard time catering to local markets. For a cut of sales, Baozun acts as a middleman, handling warehousing and logistics, and creates a storefront in an online mall that gives Nike direct control over its products and consumer confidence in the authenticity of purchases. That is critical in China, where there is real fear about whether goods bought online are fake.

Eidelman: I still see opportunity in big e-commerce stocks. It is rare to find companies with reach like Alibaba’s, which is the world’s largest online retailer. Alibaba is one of two players trying to consolidate online groceries in China—like what Amazon is trying with Whole Foods. If successful, Alibaba will penetrate an even larger market. The groceries market is very fragmented; it is not crazy to think that Alibaba will be much bigger over time.

Jain: Alibaba is one of our largest positions, and there is headroom. But the question is where can you find growth that is not appreciated. For that, you have to leave Asia.

And go where?

Jain: Russia. Beneath the headlines about how much of a threat Russia is, the economy is improving and there have been strong reforms. Companies have cut costs meaningfully, which is beginning to pay off. We own Sberbank of Russia [SBER.Russia], which is partly controlled by the central bank and holds half of the country’s retail deposits. The banking system has consolidated dramatically, and corporate governance has improved, with more than 300 banking licenses revoked over the past couple of years. Yet Sberbank trades at just 6.5 times next 12-month earnings and has generated 20%-plus return on equity—in the middle of a recession.

Eidelman: Russia looks cheap, but for a reason. I can’t come up with three Russian companies you can buy today and not think about for 10 years. But we continue to see plenty of room for Alibaba to grow its earnings over the next five years.

Jain: I’m not negative on Alibaba. But the single biggest risk in emerging markets is Chinese government intervention in the technology market. I’m not saying that will happen, but it is something to watch.

China held its twice-a-decade Congress of the Communist Party last month. What were the major takeaways, especially on the prospects of the government’s intervention in the technology market?

Ishida: The Congress provides a road map for future economic and foreign policy. While it reaffirmed Xi Jinping as the most powerful leader since Deng Xiaoping, it doesn’t make him a dictator, because there are limits to his power within the party. We are unlikely to see significant changes to economic policy. China will continue to emphasize quality of growth over quantity, entrepreneurship, and reducing risk in the financial sector. Xi also committed to dealing with income inequality, as well as improving health care and education, and the consequences of pollution.

Jain: Xi’s consolidation of power suggests government policies will be much more consistent and ruthlessly implemented. For example, China is going to accelerate shutting down excess capacity at state-owned enterprises in polluting industries, like steel. That will make state-owned enterprises more profitable, which should help banks.

Schwab: Since 2015, reforms have removed about 5% of the coal sector’s capacity, which benefits China Shenhua Energy [1088.Hong Kong]. But the bigger question is how to handicap an indefinite period of Xi. It adds uncertainty for dominant companies like Alibaba, regarding the extent to which they become an extension of the government and are expected to behave in the interest of society’s “greater good.” American internet companies are enduring similar scrutiny in some areas.


Despite the threat of greater state involvement, Chinese internet stocks are big holdings for many of you. Why?

Ishida: It’s the cost of doing business in China. Unless the government exerts more control by getting seats on the board or otherwise directing future decisions, intervention is unlikely to become a significant risk.

Eidelman: If, say, power utilities were making an enormous profit by overcharging people, the government has an interest in shutting that down. The closer the company is to the consumer, the less likely the government is going to intervene. If you tell a Chinese citizen they can’t use [messaging app] WeChat, that is not going to fly.

China reaffirmed its commitment to infrastructure with One Belt, One Road. What does that initiative mean for investors?

Schwab: China is committing $1 trillion to infrastructure spending in developing countries, creating opportunities for Chinese construction companies, cementing geopolitical alliances, and securing markets for China’s goods—and expanding China’s influence abroad while the U.S. appears to be withdrawing. For some comparison, the U.S. invested $130 billion [in today’s dollars] in Western Europe under the Marshall Plan after World War II.

One Belt should reduce the correlation between emerging markets and developed markets, as trade between emerging countries increases. Already, developed markets account for just 40% of emerging markets’ exports, down from 60% three decades ago.

Eidelman: The Chinese are building three roads that will crisscross Pakistan, helping them access a strategically important port. The ultimate benefits are the fruits of the infrastructure, like increased commerce or the reduction in transport times.

Ishida: Pakistan’s economy is going to benefit. It’s already visible. We own auto maker Indus Motor [INDU.Pakistan], which will benefit from better roads and power grids.

Let’s turn to Pakistan’s neighbor, India, which has been a favored market in the past few years. What now?

Eidelman: I’m most excited about the political change, starting with India’s decision to give everyone a national ID number, followed by a well-sequenced series of moves that included trying to give everyone a bank account and demonetization. Plus, the GST.

The GST is a new goods and services tax put in place to overhaul a tangle of state and federal taxes. That’s smart. But demonetization caused strife for a couple of months as cash was withdrawn from circulation overnight. What is the end result of these reforms?

Eidelman: Eventually, the reforms should cut down on tax avoidance and take the sand out of the gears of commerce. India also recently said it would recapitalize the state banks [to deal with bad loans]. About 70% of the banking sector can’t lend, which has hampered investment in the country, so that is an important step. That said, markets have priced in a decent amount of this.

Which companies will benefit the most from these new reforms?

Eidelman: Take the national ID. It slashes customer-service costs for banks like IndusInd Bank [IIB.India] because now it doesn’t have to send a fellow out to the townships where there are no street names to sign someone up. Now that costs are much lower, the banks can target some of the country’s large, unbanked population.

Schwab: We own jeweler Titan [TTAN.India]. Its shares have more than doubled this year, but the company benefits from the GST, which will force mom-and-pop competitors to pay taxes.

Ishida: Titan is a quality company, but it’s very expensive. PC Jeweller [PCJL.India] is a smaller alternative. Sales growth will pick up over the next five years as it gains market share. About 70% of the jewelry business is unorganized, which means they don’t pay taxes; that’s a huge advantage. The GST will drive those unorganized mom-and-pops out. I’m not sure Prime Minister Modi wanted to do that.

Jain: That’s an important point. About 90% of Indian employment is unorganized. The idea of everyone paying taxes looks wonderful sitting in an Ivy League tower, but on the ground, business is slowing and affecting corporate earnings.

Investors have cheered these reforms, but will they bring problems in the near term?

Jain: I have had as much as 30% of the fund in India in the past; today it is 6%. Earnings growth has slowed dramatically in parts of the market like pharmaceuticals, information-technology services, and staples. And once India recapitalizes the pubic-sector banks, the private-sector banks will see competition return, potentially hurting net interest margins or pushing them to make riskier loans. Another potential risk: Almost all the credit growth is coming from consumer retail. In three to five years, the private-sector banks are more likely to see a credit cycle than not. I still like HDFC Bank [HDB], which is the best of the bunch, but others have already seen nonperforming loans rise.

While growth is slowing in India, it is just picking up in Brazil. What’s going on there?

Jain: Brazil is in the early stages of recovery in noncommodity-oriented companies, and the government there has also begun reforms, notably of its labor market. We own several services companies like Qualicorp [QUAL3.Brazil], which is the dominant provider of insurance and health-care services.

Eidelman: I lightened up a couple of months ago after adding a lot at the end of 2015 and early 2016. The market got expensive and Brazil is not out of the woods politically. We own Kroton Educacional [KROT3.Brazil], which provides vocational education and has good corporate culture and a dividend. Education is a big theme globally; people will pay unlimited amounts to get ahead.

The consumer has long been a big theme in investing in the emerging markets. Has that changed?

Ishida: India’s economy is more emerging than China’s. Gross domestic product per capita [a proxy for economic health] is about $10,000 in China, but just $1,500 in India, so the way to benefit from rising consumption differs in these two countries. While a noodle company in China is seeing no volume growth, it is still a good way to benefit in India because incomes are rising from a lower base. A better way to invest in the consumer in China is through e-commerce, leisure, and hotels like China Lodging Group [HTHT]. We also really like health care. Indian generic drugmakers will struggle over the next five years due to increased competition—they did well for years because of their low costs, but Square Pharmaceuticals [SQUARE.Bangladesh] in Bangladesh says they can hire a chemist at a third of the price of the Indians. That’s a big deal.

What about luxury-goods stocks?

Jain: There is a shift away from conspicuous consumption. It’s much more about experiences. We own InterGlobe Aviation [INDIGO.India], an Indian airline known as IndiGo. It is the lowest cost per seat mile in the world and has grown from nothing in 2006 to controlling 40% of the market.

What other trends are emerging?

Eidelman: Customers are willing to pay up for services and goods—that is new. The Chinese like deep-frying, and if you don’t have an extraction hood, your kitchen doesn’t look so good. Hangzhou Robam Appliances [002508.China] makes range hoods and has the same cachet as Sub-Zero and Wolf. The trend is also playing out with JD.com [JD]. Consumers are going to the online retailer, not because things are cheaper but for customer service and because they know it is reliable.

Ishida: There’s a lot of growth in automation. For example, China has become a high-wage country, and Chinese textile maker Shenzhou International Group Holdings [2313.Hong Kong] has moved operations to lower-wage countries like Cambodia, and recently built a fully automated plant in Vietnam. It’s an excellent company and a critical part of the supply chain for customers like Uniqlo, Adidas [ADS.Germany], and Nike.

For years, China’s soaring debt has loomed over the market. Is it a risk?

Eidelman: It was a black swan event I had been nervous about, but I am more relaxed now that China has allowed its currency to float. By breaking the peg with the dollar, China no longer has to follow U.S. monetary policy and raise rates when its economy is slowing. China has also tightened the limits around taking capital in and out of the country, limiting pressure on the currency.

Ishida: Much of the high debt levels are at state-owned enterprises. Over the past three years, these companies have reduced their debt issuance. That will continue, though very slowly, lowering the risk a bit.

Jain: I’m not as worried about China’s debt creating a global crisis; most of the debt is owned domestically. The Chinese also have a very high savings rate, allowing the country to handle nonperforming loans without being at the mercy of foreigners.

What worries you?

Eidelman: There is some froth. For instance, Tencent’s online publishing platform China Literature [772.Hong Kong] doubled in its recent public offering. I wouldn’t be surprised if we saw a selloff, but we are much more positive on the earnings-per-share trajectory than before. I’d be in the buy-the-dip camp.

Schwab: While everyone thinks of emerging markets as a commodity-driven market, technology stocks make up 30% of the index. Alibaba and Tencent would probably fall in sympathy if there is a big correction in FANG stocks in the U.S., creating a disproportionate impact on emerging markets. And while China has telegraphed slower economic growth next year as it continues to deleverage, it could still create an air pocket in the market. There are also a slew of elections coming up, including those in South Africa, Brazil, and Mexico, and there’s always potential for volatility. Lastly, the escalation of tensions between Riyadh and Tehran after the Saudis intercepted a missile, and an anticorruption crackdown by Prince Mohammed bin Salman that included arrests of dozens of princes, ministers, and businessmen earlier this month, should not be underestimated as a potential source of volatility.

That’s a long list of worries, gentlemen. Thanks for your time.